Source for olive wood

[robutacion]

Well gentlemen and ladies, we are all mature civilized people in here, (or we should) and these discussions should be seen not as personal marathon but a educative and informative opportunity, while some of you may heard of this too many times, for others this is a completely new issue, as newcomers to the world of pen turning so, my objective is to educated and inform new people that, they should be aware that, the famous BOW/JOW pen blanks, are not ALL what they appear to be, there is less and less true Holy land Olive wood grown circulating, for the reasons I clearly explained, there is lots of FALSE Olive wood pen blanks claimed to be from trees from the Holy land.

The certificate of authenticity provided or claim to be "authentic" are not so, in MOST of cases so, don't fall into the trap of underestimating the issue, if you really care about getting what you think you are getting, take your time to look for things that don't look right, look for poor quality Olive wood blanks with a card/certificate attached and at low prices, look for the grain and sapwood colouration when wet (water/saliva, etc), look for blank size and how its presented, do not buy blanks that have a certificate only because they have one, ask questions to the vendor and make sure that now you are aware of FAKE Holy land Olive wood, you done your best to verify its origin, that's my message...!

Cheers
George

 

[robutacion]

Now, I sure prefer a wood with a story attached, hell yeah...! this explain what I take the time to provide as much information about any of the woods I make available to others, and even if I don't, I still tell the story...!

Make no mistake, I like to know that wood from the Holy land will be available to those that specifically want it for religious reasons, there is a strong and very emotional attachment of owning a piece of wood from the Holy land, of a few species available, the one that has been most misused by less scrupulous people, with $ sign as the main goal, is no doubt, the BOW (Bethlehem Olive Wood).

I want to believe that, these religious people that I have a great respect for but, not associated with, have the right to know that MAY have been or WILL BE used for their believes and sold something that MAY not be the real thing, they have the right to be aware of this, at least...! Is no easy task to be 100% sure of the false and true Holy land Olive wood however, there should be a question mark and a need for careful purchasing care.

I don't want, far from it, to see the Holy land wood not to be available to people, I want BOW to be available to those that made the decision to purchase the true Holy land Olive wood. I want people, particularly those with religious tendencies to be aware they are the main target in this false trade, they have the right to know and make their own decisions, regardless that them may be...!

As for the Olive trees is Israel, and according to official documentation provided by Israeli authorities, most old plantations were target and destroyed over the years, most of those areas have been replanted with new olive wood trees and are carefully guarded by authorities, reason they are protected species now, there are millions of Olive trees in Israel but, the majority of them are 50 years old and younger. Unavailability of much topsoil thickness over the underground rock surface is detrimental to the slow growth of a tree species of natural slow formation/growth...!

So, what I meant was, yes there are plenty of Olive trees left in Israel but, their capability to produce excess wood (large trimmings) is very limited and therefore unable to support on its own the world demand for quality heartwood pen blanks or other blanks. The local artisans, most either olive tree owners or close related to those that are, get the majority of what is removed from these trees, they make their living out of their carvings and have done so for hundreds of years, they would waste a quality log to cut into pen blanks, no way in hell, they will use that wood to be best quality items they produce, resulting in a better monetary rewards/returns to them.

The Olive wood trimmings alone, are just not possible to support the BOW industry of pen blanks supply, trees have been cut illegally and a black market of olive trees wood in Israel is very real, people need money and do whatever it takes to get it, this is their richest natural source and therefore "easy pickings"

Israeli authorities are aware of this and god forgive those caught in that black market, the problem is that some of the bigger players, have lots of money and plenty of government connections, and we all know what that means, huh...???

It become a lot easier and less risky to look elsewhere for the supply of quality Olive wood in some European countries, Spain, Portugal, Greece have plenty but, the biggest of them all is Italy, and this is the place from where most of the olive wood imported from Israel, comes from...!

Does any of this make any sense to you...??? maybe yes and maybe no, no one is forcing you to believe it, or even become involved.

From experience I know that, lots of people ready and like these posts but wouldn't dare to say a thing as they know that all of a certain it all can blow out in a big fight and heated arguments, most of those that are very familiar with my thoughts/claims and believes in this issue, have learn that I don't back down or off so, they will all say, "oh no, not again...!" this is the polite thoughts as I'm not going to describe what else they may be saying about it..!

Anyway peoples, like it or not, believe it or not, accept it or not, no one is forcing you to, no one makes you read these posts and no one forces you to decided to say something or not, I appreciate people being able to participate without being rude or disrespectful, everyone is welcome to participate and have their say without being concerned or afraid of being "marked" in anyway shape or form, unfortunately, human nature is not that perfect and we get "marked" in more ways than one, the main thing is to be truthful to yourself and ignore the bad weather, sunny days are always around the corner...!:wink::biggrin:

Cheers
George

 

[robutacion]

George,

In an attempt to "answer" your question, I purchase from a couple different sources for a couple reasons.

First I try to encourage both to send me the best they have (I don't shop price, I shop "quality"). I place an order for 500 from each (or nearest easy shipping number). So far this has gotten me wood that I consider "good".

I have purchased olive wood for nearly 20 years. In the early part of those years, I got some pretty pedestrian pieces. So, I know what "junk" looks like. NOW, I am getting much better wood, but MANY have grain on one side of the blank. Some have little or no grain. But, with 1000 pieces to choose from, I ship what I would like to receive.

If the "world price" has gone down, I guess I am not a 'savvy' buyer. I pay local sources more than "market price" for American wood. We are not interested in being the "cheapest" or even "cost competitive". I am looking for pen makers of my own ilk- I buy what I believe will make an expensive pen. Material cost of $20 still allows a nice profit on a $100 pen.

If you use any old wood, you shouldn't expect a premium price for your pen.

As to those who say, "oh, Ed's just talking like a vendor". What are YOU when you are selling at a show? I buy and sell the same way--I have to BELIEVE my product is better or it won't be MY product.

To each his own ethics. These are mine.

Since I can't be in all parts of the world with my chain saw, there is some faith in postmarks---I don't KNOW of a better way.

Thanks Ed, for taking the time to reply to me...!:wink:

Your order volume of such product sure gives you plenty to chose from, it is a simple fact of wood yield that, one will try to get the most out of each log when good value is involved therefore, and being paid by the blank,m I'm not surprised that they would "squeeze" is lots of second grade stuff among such big orders, and while you get the wood for the right price, it may not endup too bad, when you make your own selection of the blanks you want to represent you and the store and have plenty of freebies that people always appreciated, (for the price, who dares to complain..???:wink::biggrin::biggrin

Is nothing wrong with your "vendor" principles and criteria, quality and quantity are very different things, none is right or wrong, each one has its own merits and principles...!

The price differences that I was referring to, are a very interesting subject, particularly when one searches into the subject in depth such as myself, not everyone's cup of tea but very interesting, never the less. I'm not going to expand it any further here, as I respect you as a vendor and if you feel that is important for you to know, you are most welcome to do your own research on the subject or send me a PM and I will provide you with a email address for you to contact me at, not the one in my signature...!

And while I don't totally agree with this statement of yours "If you use any old wood, you shouldn't expect a premium price for your pen." I understand the sentiment behind it.

I'm glad that you take quality over quantity, in fact, that is no surprise really, your vendor beginnings started or at least grown, with your association with IAP as a "regular" member, selling stuff to this "mob":biggrin: isn't an easy task as they are all very "fussy" and know quality when they see it so, I don't think that would have much of a choice, is either "their" way or the highway, huh...??? Off-course, no disrespect intended to anyone on IAP, these are very common Aussie terms to describe a true fact...!:wink:

As for the authenticity of the Olive wood you are getting from your 2 suppliers, I can not ascertain the one way or the other, I could if I could afford to visit Israel and spend some time around, that would be easy but without that possibility, I simply ask you to be vigilant and be curious, ask questions, ask for evidence do whatever you have to do to make sure those buying the product from you can believe, they are getting the real thing, I understand your predicament but anything else/extra that you can provided to your clients that tells them, your BOW is just not like any other BOW, it will only benefit you...!

Cheers
George