OFFICIAL M14X.8 X 3 TAP/DIE SIGN UP THREAD

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Crap!!

OK. So if we have enough people that really think that a 1.5 inch die is needed then i guess i will jump in on it. Yes i will have to buy a new die holder, but i guess better safe then sorry. I have already cut some aluminum with the 12mm set, so f i cut aluminum with this larger set and i really running the risk of breaking it?????

Does everyone really think that we need the 1.5" die???

Please advise me!! I will go with whatever is the best option for this item.

Justin
 
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Timebandit said:
Crap!!

OK. So if we have enough people that really think that a 1.5 inch die is needed then i guess i will jump in on it. Yes i will have to buy a new die holder, but i guess better safe then sorry. I have already cut some aluminum with the 12mm set, so f i cut aluminum with this larger set and i really running the risk of breaking it?????

Does everyone really think that we need the 1.5" die???

Please advise me!! I will go with whatever is the best option for this item.

Justin
Click to expand...

Well, since no one has used this particular die, no advice based on experience is available. In my case, I was doing some threading yesterday when I got to thinking about comments made by Borg B BOrg and the approximate wall thickness dimensions he posted.

I took a look at a 2" dia aluminum rod and thought that was just the thing to make a holder from so that was that!

I still believe that we probably won't be needing the extra wall thickness for acrylics or ebonite BUT...... who knows what we'll be tapping a few months down the road! Last year I never thought I would be making stainless pens but after Skippy's bolt pen tutorial that all changed. Something about an ounce of prevention......:)
 
Texatdurango said:
Timebandit said:
Crap!!

OK. So if we have enough people that really think that a 1.5 inch die is needed then i guess i will jump in on it. Yes i will have to buy a new die holder, but i guess better safe then sorry. I have already cut some aluminum with the 12mm set, so f i cut aluminum with this larger set and i really running the risk of breaking it?????

Does everyone really think that we need the 1.5" die???

Please advise me!! I will go with whatever is the best option for this item.

Justin
Click to expand...

Well, since no one has used this particular die, no advice based on experience is available. In my case, I was doing some threading yesterday when I got to thinking about comments made by Borg B BOrg and the approximate wall thickness dimensions he posted.

I took a look at a 2" dia aluminum rod and thought that was just the thing to make a holder from so that was that!

I still believe that we probably won't be needing the extra wall thickness for acrylics or ebonite BUT...... who knows what we'll be tapping a few months down the road! Last year I never thought I would be making stainless pens but after Skippy's bolt pen tutorial that all changed. Something about an ounce of prevention......:)
Click to expand...

Thanks Tex. I wish i had some 2' aluminum rod just laying a round:rolleyes: and a good enough metal lathe to make me a new holder, but just aint happening...nice piece you made though.

I think your right about the larger die. I think i will do it just to be safe. Looking at the 12mm there isnt a lot of material outside the chip holes and i can see myself making another aluminum pen...woundt want to risk it.

Thanks
 
Mike please put me down for the 1.5" die........and......since i can be a butterfingers sometimes and i have a few extra dollars this month, put me down for 2 taps and 2 dies. I bought an extra set of the 12mm recently because i tend to drop things and have already dropped the 12mm tap once,luckily no damage. Its been a couple of years since anyone did the 12mm group buy, and its happened twice lately, but it might not happen for another couple of years, and this is the first time on this larger size....it might be a couple of years for this one to happen again...if ever...so i am going to play it safe. I think this new 14mm is going to be a great buy and really opens things up, because the are absolutely no kits parts(not that im using any now) that will mate with these.....its all up to us to figure it out.

Thanks
 
1-Chugbug ...+bottom tap
2-TexatDurango................+1.5 die
3-TomW
4-TImeBandit....................+1.5 2 sets of each
5-rstought.........................+1.5
6-dtswebb
7-wade45.........................+1.5
8-rsjimenez
9-ragz
10-turbowagon
11-Borg B BOrg +bottoming tap ...+1.5 die
12- Curly +bottoming tap......+1.5 die size
13-mr burls.
14-Mark D..........................+1.5
15-gwd
16-Dan F ..........................+1.5
17-Its Virgill
18-rudya7
19-wizard first set standard die
19a wizard second set +1.5 die
20-grampy122
21-043Turning......+bottoming tap......1.5die
22-joefyffe
23-evjenkins
24-Dave Turner
25-Jerryconn
26-apple320
 
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Looking at my 12mm die, is there any reason that the chip holes would have to be moved for the 14mm? It seems they can just drill the central hole larger and move the threads 1 mm further into the chip holes. The outer walls should be the same thickness. Or is there something 'magic' about the position of the threads relative to the holes? I'm not a die maker so I can only speculate.
 
Dave Turner said:
Looking at my 12mm die, is there any reason that the chip holes would have to be moved for the 14mm? It seems they can just drill the central hole larger and move the threads 1 mm further into the chip holes. The outer walls should be the same thickness. Or is there something 'magic' about the position of the threads relative to the holes? I'm not a die maker so I can only speculate.
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Thats what i thought to. I have no clue, but looking at all the other dies i have the chip holes are the same size no matter what size the actual thread cutters are. I am sure it has to do with the rigidity of the die. Got a feeling those chip holes are that size for a reason.
 
Dave Turner said:
Looking at my 12mm die, is there any reason that the chip holes would have to be moved for the 14mm? It seems they can just drill the central hole larger and move the threads 1 mm further into the chip holes. The outer walls should be the same thickness. Or is there something 'magic' about the position of the threads relative to the holes? I'm not a die maker so I can only speculate.
Click to expand...

The holes may or may not be moved when they make the die and that would be a question that Tapco would be able to answer if they don't have a limit to pesky questions. :wink: Mike is the best judge of if, or how to ask since he has had the conversations with them. I would think they have pre-made die blanks that are used with each size range of thread and since we are at the top end of their recommended diameter range the die might very well end up being the same as the 12mm ones. Something to consider is that if the chip holes are the same as the 12mm, when the larger 14mm is cut there would be a steeper effective cutting angle as a result that would be closer to a scraping action rather than a cutting one. How that would actually affect the cutting of plastics and metals I don't think many of us would actually know.

I still prefer the larger die if the numbers can accommodate.
 
Timebandit said:
...... i tend to drop things and have already dropped the 12mm tap once,luckily no damage. ....
Thanks
Click to expand...

Justin,

Luckily there is help for folks like you...... http://www.harborfreight.com/4-piece-anti-fatigue-foam-mat-set-94635.html

Trust me, I know from experience! :) Not only are these babies life savers when dropping delicate parts but they work wonders at keeping the feet and back comfy when standing for long periods. I have them everywhere and while they look like crap, they work!
 

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Texatdurango said:
Timebandit said:
...... i tend to drop things and have already dropped the 12mm tap once,luckily no damage. ....
Thanks
Click to expand...

Justin,

Luckily there is help for folks like you...... http://www.harborfreight.com/4-piece-anti-fatigue-foam-mat-set-94635.html

Trust me, I know from experience! :) Not only are these babies life savers when dropping delicate parts but they work wonders at keeping the feet and back comfy when standing for long periods. I have them everywhere and while they look like crap, they work!
Click to expand...


LOL!!......trust me i have these....just not enough of them. I have them right in front of both lathes, the work bench and the bandsaw....problem is when i try to dig through the pile of tools and parts next to my lath(since i have no real space to speak of next to the lathe) and something goes sliding off onto the unprotected concrete and i say a bad word:biggrin:

So far all i have is those two lathes, the bandsaw and my small work area in my garage...Ehhhmmm...."Pen Studio".... so i just cant justify covering the whole place with them......Il just buy 2 of everything so that i have a spare:biggrin::tongue:....hows that for justification to buy more tools:tongue:
 
Mike, If possible, please change my order to two sets. I have the same "tend to drop things" ailment that Justin has. I need to get the larger mat that Tex mentioned because mine's not that big.
A question... In the event I want to switch to or add an extra 1.5" die, does anyone know of a place that sells a 1.5" die holder? I could only find the 1" die holder at LMS and have that one. Thanks. Doc
 
Mike, I'm really not trying to drive you crazy. I finally decided what I would like to do. I would like to get two sets. One set with a 1" die and the other with a 1.5" die. Thank you and will do my best not to bother you again....sorry. Doc
 
wizard said:
Mike, I'm really not trying to drive you crazy. I finally decided what I would like to do. I would like to get two sets. One set with a 1" die and the other with a 1.5" die. Thank you and will do my best not to bother you again....sorry. Doc
Click to expand...

You know......you could supersize one set with a bottoming tap!!!! :biggrin: :biggrin: :biggrin: :rolleyes:

You deserve a break today at MikeDonalds. :) :wink:
 
1-Chugbug ...+bottom tap
2-TexatDurango................+1.5 die
3-TomW
4-TImeBandit....................+1.5 2 sets of each
5-rstought.........................+1.5
6-dtswebb...... 1inch die and +1.5 die
7-wade45
8-rsjimenez........................+1.5
9-ragz
10-turbowagon
11-Borg B BOrg +bottoming tap ...+1.5
12- Curly +bottoming tap......+1.5 die size
13-mr burls.
14-Mark D..........................+1.5
15-gwd
16-Dan F ..........................+1.5
17-Its Virgill
18-rudya7
19-wizard 1 standard die set
20 wizard 1 set with ..... +1.5
21-grampy122
22-043Turning......+bottoming tap......1.5die
23-joefyffe
24-evjenkins
25-Dave Turner
26-Jerryconn
27-apple320
28-PTownsubbie............+1.5
29-stickrounder.............+1.5
 
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At this point there will be enough orders on the different sized dies you may have either size die, Or both.... Thank God they dont offer them in different colors!:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:
 
mredburn said:
At this point there will be enough orders on the different sized dies you may have either size die, Or both.... Thank God they dont offer them in different colors!:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:
Click to expand...

Actually I would like my die in a dark gun metal color NOT to be confused with black chrome however! The tap can be any color..... (midnight blue if you can get 'em!)
 
mredburn said:
At this point there will be enough orders on the different sized dies you may have either size die, Or both.... Thank God they dont offer them in different colors!:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:
Click to expand...

Well there could always be someone to ask for the starting taps too. :eek: :eek: :wink:
 
Steve Thanks for the reminder I think I forgot to save it the first time I changed it.

As for George and Pete......... I'm ignoring you!
 
Hi Guys, haven't been "buy" for a week or so, but I see there's been some new discussion on the size of the die (1" vs 1.5"). Seems there is a chance if we can get enough people that want them, that we could get the larger size!

Mike- Thanks for getting prices on the larger size! As with the bottoming tap, please put me down for the LARGER 1.5" size (die). I'm OK if it is in the 6+ price range- I think we will have at least that many.

I'm glad someone kept the issue alive (thanks to whomever it was!) . I think the debate has been pretty much been exhausted on both perspectives. But for me (and if anyone else is still on the fence and would like convincing), based on a few personal observations, here is why I would prefer the larger size:

Observation #1 - Looking at the M12 die, and trying to imagine taking away another 2mm in the diameter, it seems that a 1" die would leave a rather minimal amount of material on the die (IMHO, I think the 12mm is somewhat shy of material).

Observation #2 - Materials used and die flexing due to #1. Even though I (we) mostly use the die on acrylics, what about some of the harder materials that are available now and what may come in the future? Currently there are harder materials such as Trustone and the M3 Metal. Who knows what else may come along. I would rather have the larger die an not have to worry about any strength issues down the road.

Observation #3... (personally) I don't understand why there is even a debate over using a larger die? If it's just the size, I have been using 1.5" dies for some of my larger threads (barrel to cap), and don't have any problems (I actually use a varitey of different size dies: 1" and 1 1/2" round and 1 1/8" hex). If it's only a matter of not having a holder - there are holders available at a small cost. If I was on a tight budget, I would make a reducing adapter so I could use the larger die in my existing 1" holder. I already have one, so needing to purchase or make one is not an issue for me, but I think if I didn't have one, THAT would not be my deciding factor. That said however, if I do get the larger size, I will probably buy another holder anyway just so I don't have to keep switching the dies in and out of the same holder (and have to worry about DROPPING IT!!)

Observation #4... Why override the experts? If it were me, if the company making the die was recommending it be a 1.5" die, I would get a 1.5" die. I'm not the expert, so I would not question their recommendations. Nor would I want to kick myself later because I overrode the experts and my die wouldn't be strong enough to use on some new material that came along I wanted to try (or worse yet, did try it and broke it!).

As I said, these are just my observations. I don't pretend to be a mechanical engineer, or know anything about the manufacturing of dies, I just use a few of them.

Mike, thanks again for all your hard work-- AND patience!

John

John E. Brady
JEB's PENs
www.jebspens.com
 
With 30 commitments and 13 of them for the large die size we will get the 12+ quantity price for both sized dies. I have to go buy some fluorescent pink spray paint.:biggrin:
 
I absolutely refuse to discuss left handed threads for those of you that open your pen backwards.:eek::biggrin:
 
Now this is a Real MANS MAN color! And FYI Curly, it's JUST A COINCIDENCE that it matches my friday night outfit, I seldom wear it while turning, especially around the metal lathe! Actually it comes closer to matching my wednesday night bowling shirt.... we're a snappy team!

bNUr0gCb8GcAQwB0zRRE0-HIuUo0GzPV8xypZscZmNkRxLQYfFCIHMKKitkjNskfSAj27yghpVmUcuV3FZoCO5r7B-Y8Y7MtLjkgeFNWUp8XGPQV3ljeH69xIjMOauo7-7R9qEoErFg3FBntTw
 
Yup, the taper taps are doing just fine. The bottoming taps are lagging but if you want a bottoming tap, order a second taper and carefully grind the tip of the taper tap down.

There might be a song in there... Grind your taper tap down boys, grind your taper tap down....Hmmm dont think i will quit my day job just yet.
 
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Mike, just fell off the fence, sign me up for 2 sets with the 1.5" die please.

Not fussy about the colour:rolleyes:

Guess I'll have to make myself a 1.5" die holder now.:wink:
 
1-Chugbug ...+bottom tap
2-TexatDurango................+1.5 die
3-TomW
4-TImeBandit....................+1.5 2 sets of each
5-rstought.........................+1.5
6-dtswebb...... 1inch die and +1.5 die
7-wade45
8-rsjimenez........................+1.5
9-ragz
10-turbowagon
11-Borg B BOrg +bottoming tap ...+1.5
12- Curly +bottoming tap......+1.5 die size
13-mr burls.........................+1.5
14-Mark D..........................+1.5
15-gwd
16-Dan F ..........................+1.5
17-Its Virgill
18-rudya7
19-wizard 1 standard die set
20 wizard 1 set with ..... +1.5
21-grampy122
22-043Turning......+bottoming tap......1.5die
23-joefyffe
24-evjenkins
25-Dave Turner
26-Jerryconn
27-apple320
28-PTownsubbie............+1.5
29-stickrounder.............+1.5
30-Big shed ................+1.5 x2 sets
31-Constant Laubscher bottoming tap+1.5 x 2 sets
32-dgscott
33- John Crane.........+bottom tap +1.5
 
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