2025 Spring Triple Start Tap and Die Group Buy

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That is all I got out of the rep. That is their pricing. Honestly, not a single person has been interested in the product, and I don't foresee a rush of people to get the price down by tomorrow.

I am not extending the sale any longer. People are dropping out due to developing economic conditions and uncertainty. I just lost another order since I wrote my last message. Every day that passes, it becomes harder and harder to get replacement orders and keep people from dropping out. I want to maintain where we are now and get everyone participating at the best prices possible on the in-demand products.
 
Latest numbers:

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You got us to 6 on the taps. Thank you. I have now fixed all the numbers on the chart. I see the 2 m10 taps on the order for you. We're not there on the dies yet.
 
You can add an m13 bottom tap and 2 m10 dies to my order.
That should get us to 24 on the m13 taps and 6 on the m10 dies.


I would also be nice if someone jumps in on the m9 with me. Id go up to 4 of both taps and and dies, if someone else will get the other two of each to get to 6.
 
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Jarod888 said:
You can add an m13 bottom tap and 2 m10 dies to my order.
That should get us to 24 on the m13 taps and 6 on the m10 dies.


I would also be nice if someone jumps in on the m9 with me. Id go up to 4 of both taps and and dies, if someone else will get the other two of each to get to 6.
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I'll go in for 1 set.
 
Last numbers going into the last day. I'm going to try to find some love for m15 today, but not looking too good. If anyone wants to go full in with #8 nibs, the m15 will do the job!

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I had some issues getting logged into my account but have resolved that. I'm not quite ready to move on to doing kit-less pens yet but figure I should get in on this now instead of waiting once I am ready. Plus it will help your numbers.

However I need some advice on which sets to get. I don't have a digital caliper handy so I'll just say the most comfortable pen I own and the size I would most likely want to produce is my Visconti Homo Sapiens. I'd also be using #6 Jowo nibs. Cap threads on the body.

With that in mind would I be wanting and M15 set and M13 set? AnM15 set and M12 set? Or some other combination?

I know I can get the Jowo tap from Meister.
 
So, what you should do is measure the outside of the threads on the body. This will give you an idea on the size you need.

Essentially, a 13 mm thread is the most common size. 12 is smaller and more elegant and 14 and 15 are bigger pens.

Here is what I found on line.

So based on below, m13 is probably the right size, but it could be m14 too.

M15 will be big, because there is extra material beyond the thread size.

Typically, there is about 2 mm difference in outside body size compared to the threads.
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The Visconti you mention has a measurement of 14.3mm on the body and 16.5mm on the cap at the widest point. That is about the size I make my m13 x .8 pens at the widest point. I would pair that with an m10x1 set for the section threads.

edit: after seeing @Jarod888 response I realize there is a range for the Homo Sapiens, and they are all not the same.
 
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Yea, I just grabbed the dimensions from Goulet's site.
Diameter - Body 14.3mm (0.6in)
Diameter - Cap (without clip) 16.5mm (0.6in)
Diameter - Grip (mm) 11.0mm

I know a lot of makes use single start for the section. I would be targeting eyedropper filled pens with a single silicone gasket. Is the single start M10x1 good enough to avoid leaks, or is it better to use the M9x.75? The M9 I think is too thin as the #6 Jowo tap is 7.4x0.5 and I think the general rule is to have a 2mm wall.

If the M10x1 is sufficient for eyedropper pens then I think my best choice is M14x.8 set and M10x1 set. Maybe get the M13x0.8 set as well while I can and can afford it.

Is my logic sound?
 
I would think m9 is too small for #6 nibs.
It can be done, but requires high precision sizing, likely beyond the precision of a wood lathe, but easily achievable with a metal lathe, even one of the cheap, small Chinese varieties from Amazon.
I think the general rule is:
M12:M9:#5
M13:M10:#6
M14:M10:#6
M15:M11:#8
 
The m9 x .75 would be small for a #6. It is better suited for a #5 nib.

It is all personal preference, but I pair an m14 cap thread with an m11x1 or m11x.75 single start for the section.

I use the following for each, but there are many ways. All combos would work as an eyedropper as long as your threads are well-cut and of good quality.

m12 cap thread = m9 section thread (#5 nib)
m13 cap thread = m10 section thread (#6 nib)
m14 cap thread = m11 section thread (#6 nib and #8 with thin wall)
 
bmmcwhirt said:
Yea, I just grabbed the dimensions from Goulet's site.
Diameter - Body 14.3mm (0.6in)
Diameter - Cap (without clip) 16.5mm (0.6in)
Diameter - Grip (mm) 11.0mm

I know a lot of makes use single start for the section. I would be targeting eyedropper filled pens with a single silicone gasket. Is the single start M10x1 good enough to avoid leaks, or is it better to use the M9x.75? The M9 I think is too thin as the #6 Jowo tap is 7.4x0.5 and I think the general rule is to have a 2mm wall.

If the M10x1 is sufficient for eyedropper pens then I think my best choice is M14x.8 set and M10x1 set. Maybe get the M13x0.8 set as well while I can and can afford it.

Is my logic sound?
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If you can afford it, I would get each set. We are at or near the best discount levels and it is unlikely that we will have another group but for a few years. They have consistently gone up in price.
 
Jarod888 said:
I would think m9 is too small for #6 nibs.
It can be done, but requires high precision sizing, likely beyond the precision of a wood lathe, but easily achievable with a metal lathe, even one of the cheap, small Chinese varieties from Amazon.
I think the general rule is:
M12:M9:#5
M13:M10:#6
M14:M10:#6
M15:M11:#8
Click to expand...
I have actually been looking at some of those small metal mills that can be easily converted to CNC. I do have a small 3018 CNC that I think there is an ad-on available to convert the Y-axis to a rotational axis.

hooked said:
The m9 x .75 would be small for a #6. It is better suited for a #5 nib.

It is all personal preference, but I pair an m14 cap thread with an m11x1 or m11x.75 single start for the section.

I use the following for each, but there are many ways. All combos would work as an eyedropper as long as your threads are well-cut and of good quality.

m12 cap thread = m9 section thread (#5 nib)
m13 cap thread = m10 section thread (#6 nib)
m14 cap thread = m11 section thread (#6 nib and #8 with thin wall)
Click to expand...
The M14x.8/M11x.75 sounds ideal. Since there is no M11x.75 in this group buy, It would probably b the M10x1 assuming there is no concerns about dropper filled pens leaking. I'm thinking with the use of a recessed silicone gasket on the section and Krytox 205 silicone grease for the threads it should not be an issue, but I'm not sure.

May I ask where you got your M11x.75?
 
bmmcwhirt said:
I have actually been looking at some of those small metal mills that can be easily converted to CNC. I do have a small 3018 CNC that I think there is an ad-on available to convert the Y-axis to a rotational axis.


The M14x.8/M11x.75 sounds ideal. Since there is no M11x.75 in this group buy, It would probably b the M10x1 assuming there is no concerns about dropper filled pens leaking. I'm thinking with the use of a recessed silicone gasket on the section and Krytox 205 silicone grease for the threads it should not be an issue, but I'm not sure.

May I ask where you got your M11x.75?
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I get M11x.75 dies/taps from Victor Machinery Exchange, but they have been out of stock lately. You can also get them from Barry Gross, Amazon, and other online retailers like drillsandcutters.com. Look for adjustable round dies. These will all be cheaper tools from China, so I don't know what will happen to the prices. Sometimes, you get a dud, quality control is not the best, but they are relatively cheap...now.
 
Final stretch: Current numbers. If nobody else jumps in, I will get another m14 tap to get us to 12.

Thanks to everyone for helping out and getting this done. I just wish I could have got the m15 group a couple more people. I couldn't find the people. If anyone has any last minute orders or changes, please get them in. I'm going to send out subtotals and orders to everyone tomorrow to make sure everything is correct. Invoices/payment info will follow after that.


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All invoices have been sent via private message. If anyone has any questions, please send me a message. I will not be around until tonight, but I will respond when I can later this evening.

I hope to never hear the words tap and die ever again! :D;) I give a ton of credit to everyone who has done this previously. Thanks for all the help everyone.

On a side note, all shipping was calculated through USPS. When I ship I will be using pirate ship so rates may go down a bit. I will issue refunds if needed when the time comes to ship.
 
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Garrett'sWoodworx said:
Are you comfortable that PayPal won't cause trouble if you receive all that money via F&F? I understand the 1099 issue completely and don't mind sending you a check tomorrow if that would be better for you.
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Tax laws are very complex. However as long as you don't use invoicing and everything is friends and family, they do not send a W2 and it's up to you to correctly claim anything that is real income. In this case there is no markup, and no service fees thus no income to claim.

Paypal started out primarily for sending money to friends and families and for group buys. You use to be able to use the invoicing without having a W2 from Paypal. However they grew and expanded and some legal issues came up where they had to get FDIC accredited and now invoiced payments result in a W2. You still get a form from them yearly for all non-invoiced transactions that you are supposed to claim any of the transactions that constitute income.
 
bmmcwhirt said:
Tax laws are very complex. However as long as you don't use invoicing and everything is friends and family, they do not send a W2 and it's up to you to correctly claim anything that is real income. In this case there is no markup, and no service fees thus no income to claim.

Paypal started out primarily for sending money to friends and families and for group buys. You use to be able to use the invoicing without having a W2 from Paypal. However they grew and expanded and some legal issues came up where they had to get FDIC accredited and now invoiced payments result in a W2. You still get a form from them yearly for all non-invoiced transactions that you are supposed to claim any of the transactions that constitute income.
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As a paypal user for 20+ years I actually understand all of that, but I'm also aware of the fact that paypal has held funds and made folks jump through extra hoops to prove they were not breaking the rules (terms of service). I don't want him to have to deal with that, especially given the amount of money he will be dealing with.
 
I haven't done anything like this before, and the people I have spoken with who have done it previously haven't mentioned any incidents. I have read that there are some surprisingly large maximums for friends and family transactions, which we will not even come close to.

I am open to checks if people would prefer, just PM me for my address.

I have transferred today's funds. Well, initiated, the free transfer takes 1 business day. I will verify that there was no problem transferring once completed.
 
Garrett'sWoodworx said:
As a paypal user for 20+ years I actually understand all of that, but I'm also aware of the fact that paypal has held funds and made folks jump through extra hoops to prove they were not breaking the rules (terms of service). I don't want him to have to deal with that, especially given the amount of money he will be dealing with.
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That's where them now being FDIC accredited comes in handy for you.

I believe this is the form the FDIC office had me fill out when no matter what I did or who I talked to Paypal refused to update my phone number because it's a GoogleFi Google Voice number: https://www.fdic.gov/formsdocuments/6710-06.pdf I wish I had just called the FDIC right away. I fought with Paypal for 3mo. In less than a week after filing a claim Paypal called me (on the number they refused to update in my profile) almost begging to help me. I don't know what the penalties are for breaking FDIC rules but they must be pretty harsh.
 
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