Your Mission, should you choose to accept it, is to make.......

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NGLJ

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Sep 15, 2021
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Location
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A few weeks ago I was admiring a pen with a 360 Herringbone pattern in a post here. I have thought many times if I should dive into the "Lion's Den" but was unsure about my skill level to tackle something where "perfection" is very difficult to achieve. Undaunted, I decided that I needed a new "challenge", and proceeded to "consume" all that I could in the Resources section. With grateful thanks to those who took the time to explain how it can be done, I made a start. I pretty soon realized why it is very difficult to make a wooden 360 Herringbone pen blank which has no gaps between the segments and has no chip out from turning!!

There are simply so many places that even a very minor mistake in the overall process shows up like a major mistake at the end. Needless to say, my first few attempts ended up on the "cutting room floor". You can soon get through a lot of wood, lots of thin expensive CA, and many hours. However, each iteration produced a better result, after carefully analyzing where I went wrong.

I did notice that one topic didn't appear to be "explicitly" addressed in any of the articles that I read, that is "grain orientation", although it can be ascertained from drawings in some of the articles. There are many possible combinations having regard for glue-up, turning, and final appearance. I cannot claim to have investigated many of the options, and plan to try more. I did eventually find one which has now worked "fairly" well for me. I use the word "fairly" because I don't consider my best result so far as anywhere near perfect or what I hope to eventually achieve. Basically I glue up the 2 mirror image pieces avoiding gluing end grain. However, I did notice end grain was glued in one of the articles.

There are other basic options to consider, tile size and thickness. Bigger tiles means more wood used, and more to turn off at the end. Also, the more turning that you do means more opportunity for chip out. It is sole destroying to get so close and.......%&^^&^&^. On the other hand, small tiles can be difficult to handle and glue. Thicker tiles means less levels to achieve the blank size that you are aiming for, but that also affects the final appearance. Thin tiles means more work, and more chance that a glue joint is bad or mis-aligned. Accurate glue-up can be one of the most difficult to get 100% correct when you consider that you will have 70 to 100 joints to make. Let's just say that it is a WIP (work in progress) for me. I am experimenting with jigs, and different clamping approaches. Rubber bands make some of the best clamps. For now, I ended up deciding to "standardize" on ¾" x ¾" x 3/16" tiles, and continue to refine my technique. At some point, I aim to add veneer into the mix, further complicating matters :). Please see attached my best effort so far. Please feel free to offer advice. There are simply so many different ways to achieve a good result in woodworking.
 

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I recently started making these too. Once you make a few it's easier to understand. You are correct when you say adding veneers will complicate matters, that is an understatement and you will have to completely rethink your whole grain direction ideas.
 
Nicely done Graham, absolutely love it, there's a lot of heartache and head scratching involved making 360 herringbones. They're also highly addictive once you get your head around them, keep at it 👍
 
Very nicely done. Thank you for the writeup. I have been working on some segmenting myself lately, though much simpler. Good to hear that perseverance and hard work pay off in the end.

I have come to a question with regards to glue, though. Wood glue, when gluing up boards for larger scale projects, produces a bond in the long run that can be stronger than the wood fibers themselves. Which is rather amazing, when you see three 3/4" boards glued together side to side, then smacked on the edge of a table, and the boards break while the joints remain tightly bonded.

Is there a reason CA glue, rather than wood glue, is used for segmenting work with pens? I can understand CA if other materials (metallic or plastic sheets) are used between wood pieces. But, for wood to wood...why not use wood glue instead of CA? If wood glue bonds so well with large pieces of wood, would it not bond well with smaller pieces?

Any possibility that using wood glue rather than CA might produce segmented blanks that don't blow up as easily when being turned down?








(Sorry, but, the "wood, would" just brought this slamming into the front of my brain and I gottta get it out before it consumes me!! 🤣

"A woodchuck would chuck, he would, as much wood as he could, and chuck as much wood as a woodchuck would if a woodchuck could chuck wood!"

Have a nice day!)
 
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Very nicely done. Thank you for the writeup. I have been working on some segmenting myself lately, though much simpler. Good to hear that perseverance and hard work pay off in the end.

I have come to a question with regards to glue, though. Wood glue, when gluing up boards for larger scale projects, produces a bond in the long run that can be stronger than the wood fibers themselves. Which is rather amazing, when you see three 3/4" boards glued together side to side, then smacked on the edge of a table, and the boards break while the joints remain tightly bonded.

Is there a reason CA glue, rather than wood glue, is used for segmenting work with pens? I can understand CA if other materials (metallic or plastic sheets) are used between wood pieces. But, for wood to wood...why not use wood glue instead of CA? If wood glue bonds so well with large pieces of wood, would it not bond well with smaller pieces?

Any possibility that using wood glue rather than CA might produce segmented blanks that don't blow up as easily when being turned down?








(Sorry, but, the "wood, would" just brought this slamming into the front of my brain and I gottta get it out before it consumes me!! 🤣

"A woodchuck would chuck, he would, as much wood as he could, and chuck as much wood as a woodchuck would if a woodchuck could chuck wood!"

Have a nice day!)
I've always used wood glue for bonding segments, personally I think it works better and gives time for little adjustments before it sets. The down side is the time required for wood glue to set and that maybe why others prefer CA, just my opinion. I do use CA when I'm turning my blanks down though, soak the blank with a good quality thin CA, it definitely helps prevent blow outs, especially with end grain. I set a low speed on the lathe and take fine cuts, it comes off like tissue paper, time consuming but worth it
 
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