Richard Gibson
Member
I just got some samples from Coastal Scents and they sent a freebie that says Titanium Dioxide filler. Is this a white color that I can use in PR or is it a true filler substance that is used in their make-up business?
Titanium Dioxide
- Thread starter Richard Gibson
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NewLondon88
Local Chapter Leader
Both :biggrin:
It is used as a filler, as a whitener and it makes a white blank.
It is used as a filler, as a whitener and it makes a white blank.
Richard Gibson
Member
Cool. I'll label it, put it in a jar and give it a try in a few days :tongue:
Richard Gibson
Member
Put a little on your cheek Richard. See how it looks!:biggrin:
I tried that but my pants rubbed it off...
BigShed
Member
Having worked with Titanium Dioxide most of my working life, it is the main (some would say only) white pigment used in paints, cosmetics and the fibreglass (polyester) industry.
Every white gleaming fibreglass yacht in your nearest marina has been pigmented with titanium dioxide, so I find your statement rather puzzling.
Could you elaborate on both why it inhibits the cure of polyester resin and what substance you recommend to mix with it?
Are you referring to the rutile or anatase form, or both?
In cosmetics, it's used in a small proportion to the other ingredients. It can irritate the skin if loaded too heavy.
In resins, it slows the thermal reaction. It will cure, just takes longer. Also, when used as the only whitening agent, it causes the resin to be chaulky or powdery. Calcium carbonate doesn't seem to have the same reaction in resin. It is also used in cosmetics, foods, etc.
I hope I explained it the way it sounds in my head. Just use it sparingly and it should be fine.:wink:
In resins, it slows the thermal reaction. It will cure, just takes longer. Also, when used as the only whitening agent, it causes the resin to be chaulky or powdery. Calcium carbonate doesn't seem to have the same reaction in resin. It is also used in cosmetics, foods, etc.
I hope I explained it the way it sounds in my head. Just use it sparingly and it should be fine.:wink:
BigShed
Member
Calcium carbonate is an extender, not a pigment as titanium dioxide is, and is not a "whitening agent".
In enamels, as in gel coats, titanium dioxide is used as the only pigment, as using it together with calcium carbonate or any other extender will knock the gloss. In undercoats, satin enamels etc it is used with extenders such as calcium carbonate and talc.
The chalking you refer to is a function not only of the titanium dioxide but a combination of choice of resin and pigment, ie you can't use anatase titanium dioxide for exterior enamels. It can also vary with the grade of titanium dioxide used, ie surface treated titanium dioxide has better exterior durability.
This chalking can also occur with other pigments, yellow oxide is worse than titanium dioxide.
The slowing of the thermal reaction you refer to, it doesn't inhibit it as previously stated, doesn't only occur with titanium dioxide but can occur with other pigments as well, ie carbon black. It is easily compensated for by increasing the level of catalyst, MEKP in the case of polyester resin, but is not overcome by "mixing it with something else".
As far as using titanium dioxide, or any other straight pigment, in PR casting it really should be properly dispersed and it is advisable to buy your pigments for casting in pre-dispersed form. The pearl pigments are an exception to this.
Whilst your reference to the use of titanium dioxide in cosmetics is interesting, it not only is outside my direct experience, nor is it relevant to PR casting.
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Calcium carbonate is an extender, not a pigment as titanium dioxide is, and is not a "whitening agent".
Yes, it is used as a whitening agent in certain applications. Not necessarily the main use. It is made from organic minerals just as any other pigments.
In enamels, as in gel coats, titanium dioxide is used as the only pigment, as using it together with calcium carbonate or any other extender will knock the gloss. In undercoats, satin enamels etc it is used with extenders such as calcium carbonate and talc.
I didn't say to mix titanium dioxide and calcium carbonate together.
The chalking you refer to is a function not only of the titanium dioxide but a combination of choice of resin and pigment, ie you can't use anatase titanium dioxide for exterior enamels. It can also vary with the grade of titanium dioxide used, ie surface treated titanium dioxide has better exterior durability.
Exactly. When titanium dioxide is used with Silmar, it chalks. You proved my point.
This chalking can also occur with other pigments, yellow oxide is worse than titanium dioxide.
That is the primary reason it is mixed with other ingredients. Or dispersed as you call it.
The slowing of the thermal reaction you refer to, it doesn't inhibit it as previously stated, doesn't only occur with titanium dioxide but can occur with other pigments as well, ie carbon black. It is easily compensated for by increasing the level of catalyst, MEKP in the case of polyester resin, but is not overcome by "mixing it with something else".
Using titanium dioxide in either oil disperse or water disperse WILL inhibit the cure. It doesn't stop it...just slows it. Inhibit. This is stated by the resin manufacturer and been realized in my own experience with it's use.
Carbon black has never been a problem for me. Being black, it absorbes the heat rather than reflecting it. This is in my casting set-up.
Increasing the catalyst creates more problems than it solves.
Yes, mixing it with other ingredients (dispersing is what you called it) does compensate for it. That is why manufacturers, that use it, only use it as a percentage of the product.
As far as using titanium dioxide, or any other straight pigment, in PR casting it really should be properly dispersed and it is advisable to buy your pigments for casting in pre-dispersed form. The pearl pigments are an exception to this.
This is a contradiction to your previous statement. See above. Dispersing is "mixing with something else".
Whilst your reference to the use of titanium dioxide in cosmetics is interesting, it not only is outside my direct experience, nor is it relevant to PR casting.
You my friend, are the one that mentioned it in your last post. I merely responded.
Have a nice day!:wink:
Yes, it is used as a whitening agent in certain applications. Not necessarily the main use. It is made from organic minerals just as any other pigments.
In enamels, as in gel coats, titanium dioxide is used as the only pigment, as using it together with calcium carbonate or any other extender will knock the gloss. In undercoats, satin enamels etc it is used with extenders such as calcium carbonate and talc.
I didn't say to mix titanium dioxide and calcium carbonate together.
The chalking you refer to is a function not only of the titanium dioxide but a combination of choice of resin and pigment, ie you can't use anatase titanium dioxide for exterior enamels. It can also vary with the grade of titanium dioxide used, ie surface treated titanium dioxide has better exterior durability.
Exactly. When titanium dioxide is used with Silmar, it chalks. You proved my point.
This chalking can also occur with other pigments, yellow oxide is worse than titanium dioxide.
That is the primary reason it is mixed with other ingredients. Or dispersed as you call it.
The slowing of the thermal reaction you refer to, it doesn't inhibit it as previously stated, doesn't only occur with titanium dioxide but can occur with other pigments as well, ie carbon black. It is easily compensated for by increasing the level of catalyst, MEKP in the case of polyester resin, but is not overcome by "mixing it with something else".
Using titanium dioxide in either oil disperse or water disperse WILL inhibit the cure. It doesn't stop it...just slows it. Inhibit. This is stated by the resin manufacturer and been realized in my own experience with it's use.
Carbon black has never been a problem for me. Being black, it absorbes the heat rather than reflecting it. This is in my casting set-up.
Increasing the catalyst creates more problems than it solves.
Yes, mixing it with other ingredients (dispersing is what you called it) does compensate for it. That is why manufacturers, that use it, only use it as a percentage of the product.
As far as using titanium dioxide, or any other straight pigment, in PR casting it really should be properly dispersed and it is advisable to buy your pigments for casting in pre-dispersed form. The pearl pigments are an exception to this.
This is a contradiction to your previous statement. See above. Dispersing is "mixing with something else".
Whilst your reference to the use of titanium dioxide in cosmetics is interesting, it not only is outside my direct experience, nor is it relevant to PR casting.
You my friend, are the one that mentioned it in your last post. I merely responded.
Have a nice day!:wink:
BigShed
Member
leestoresund
Member
Are you guys the feature fight on next week's RAW?
;>)
;>)
soligen
Member
I'd rather not look at this as a fight, but 2 people sharing their views with appearent disagreement. (of course, it is debatable if RAW is really even a fight)
Actually, I dont really even think they disagree, but simply are using different terminology. Differing terminology inhibits :biggrin: comminication and needs to be worked out.
DurocShark
Member
Practically speaking:
Adding enough TiDi to turn resin white will result in:
1. Need to add more catalyst to get it to fully cure. Post curing is another option if you forget, or while dialing in the ratios so as not to waste your resin.
2. The blank will be noticeably more brittle. More care will need to be used when turning.
Those are both from my experience. I use it fairly often in my casting.
BTW: It's an excellent additive for lightening colors or "opaquing" the resin. Experiment!
Adding enough TiDi to turn resin white will result in:
1. Need to add more catalyst to get it to fully cure. Post curing is another option if you forget, or while dialing in the ratios so as not to waste your resin.
2. The blank will be noticeably more brittle. More care will need to be used when turning.
Those are both from my experience. I use it fairly often in my casting.
BTW: It's an excellent additive for lightening colors or "opaquing" the resin. Experiment!