Harley2001
Member
Is there any one that makes a blank with watch parts.I have a good friend that collects clocks. and my wife dose to so i need 2 blanks.Thanks
Help Looking for a Blank
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Brooks803
Member
uh oh...just when I thought things were starting to calm down
sorry, had to say that. there's alot of controversy about a blank like that so i'm not sure the best way to help.
sorry, had to say that. there's alot of controversy about a blank like that so i'm not sure the best way to help.
ZanderPommo
Member
from what i understand its sort of trademarked and if you get it from anyone else than the original creator you may be in rather big trouble.:frown:
Phunky_2003
Member
Yeah that is a touchy subject. I've made 2 but they were for my own use and dont think I would offer any here due to basically not wanting to deal with the headaches. I am sure somebody will pop in and offer or suggest where to get some.
titan2
Member
Well, if you where to cast your own......you can go to e-Bay and get all the small pieces & parts that you'd ever want.
Paint your tube....pick your pieces, bend and coach them into shape, affix them to your prepared tube and cast.
Use your own artistic expression on what you want to make.....just don't try to make an exact copy of any that may be found on the site.
It's your art and your expression of yourself......no one can lay claim to your expressions.
That's my 2¢ and I'm sticking to them......
Barney
Paint your tube....pick your pieces, bend and coach them into shape, affix them to your prepared tube and cast.
Use your own artistic expression on what you want to make.....just don't try to make an exact copy of any that may be found on the site.
It's your art and your expression of yourself......no one can lay claim to your expressions.
That's my 2¢ and I'm sticking to them......
Barney
Russianwolf
Member
A process or design can be patented, a logo or phrase can be trademarked, a work of art (written, painted, sculpted, or cast) can be copywritten.
To the best of my knowledge, no one owns a patent on the process and defending a copywrite on something like this would be a nightmare. If the so called "originator" would like to argue the point, he can speak to my attorney. When one of the big companies decides to do so, they will be mass produced and he won't have a say in it at all.
To the best of my knowledge, no one owns a patent on the process and defending a copywrite on something like this would be a nightmare. If the so called "originator" would like to argue the point, he can speak to my attorney. When one of the big companies decides to do so, they will be mass produced and he won't have a say in it at all.
atomic ray
Member
uh oh...just when I thought things were starting to calm down
sorry, had to say that. there's alot of controversy about a blank like that so i'm not sure the best way to help.
Ok I would like clarity on this one please, even if via PM if need be...I have at least one pound of small watch parts/gears/springs...
:bananen_smilies068:
Raymond
Gary Max
Member
How fast do you need the blanks?------I got started on them and just never got the time to finish. I am building them on Seirra's. Oh----Pens made from watch parts have been around for many years.
Russianwolf
Member
http://www.penturners.org/forum/showthread.php?t=58871&highlight=clock+parts
have fun reading. There are a couple other post that spawned off this is you search clock parts.
Tony's Pens
Member
The below commit is just an opinion and not intended to be a legal statement
I don't know how anything you make can be copy-write protected as long it DOES NOT have a brand name with the letter "R"" for Registered, "T" for Trademark or "C" for copy-write included in the casting or pen blank. Also as long as the item is not an exact replica then is should be fine. If just casting random clock parts in PR is a copy-write violation then what is casting Snake Skins, Blue Jean Material, Pictures, or what ever you cast or make. I am no lawyer but I don't think you will have any problems making a pen with random clock parts. Just make sure none of the clock parts have a brand name on it. As far as making something for yourself that may be copy-write protected and then saying "it is ok because it is yours personally" then that will be ok as long as no one else ever sees it. If someone sees your personal pen with some type of copy-write protection then that is a violation.
Look at Pepsi, it is just like Coke except a few ingredients. Pepsi did not violate copy-write protection since they changed a few ingredients from Coke
I don't know how anything you make can be copy-write protected as long it DOES NOT have a brand name with the letter "R"" for Registered, "T" for Trademark or "C" for copy-write included in the casting or pen blank. Also as long as the item is not an exact replica then is should be fine. If just casting random clock parts in PR is a copy-write violation then what is casting Snake Skins, Blue Jean Material, Pictures, or what ever you cast or make. I am no lawyer but I don't think you will have any problems making a pen with random clock parts. Just make sure none of the clock parts have a brand name on it. As far as making something for yourself that may be copy-write protected and then saying "it is ok because it is yours personally" then that will be ok as long as no one else ever sees it. If someone sees your personal pen with some type of copy-write protection then that is a violation.
Look at Pepsi, it is just like Coke except a few ingredients. Pepsi did not violate copy-write protection since they changed a few ingredients from Coke
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OKLAHOMAN
Member
I don't think Barry was the first or only maker of watch part pens, how about this $19000.00 watch part pen{ http://www.slipperybrick.com/2008/10/19k-pen-with-watch-parts-that-dont-work/.......
bitshird
Member
This may or may not help, but there was a big stink by the guy that published instructions on how to do it then screamed bloody murder when someone did on similar, NOT EXACT, but similar
read this What Is Not Covered By Copyright?
It's important to note what is not covered by copyright.
Copyright covers form but not idea. It applies to the tangible artistic result — known as the "form of material expression" — not the underlying concept. So your photograph has copyright, but not the idea or viewpoint behind it. For example, if you take a great photo of some natural thing, such as a beach or Yosemite Valley, you can't stop other people from taking the same photo.
Some things are in the "public domain" and are free for the people to use. This includes artwork published before 1923; copyrights that have expired (complex); and public property such as written laws.
Copyright does not apply to facts, since these are universal not individual. Factual dates and figures can't be copyrighted, but text expressing those facts may be.
Copyright can expire. In the U.S., the duration is lifetime plus 70 years.
Copyright does not prevent resale. In the U.S., after the "first sale", the owner can resell a work as-is (the work can't be copied or resold in an altered form).
Copyright may be superceded when other laws apply, such as trademark or privacy.
Fair use is permitted. This is complex, see below.
So how can Barry claim all he claims when there are obvious other productions? Do I dare ask? Oh I guess I just did.
rjwolfe3
Member
So how can Barry claim all he claims when there are obvious other productions? Do I dare ask? Oh I guess I just did.
Lol stirring up the pot, are we?:devil:
OKLAHOMAN
Member
So how can Barry claim all he claims when there are obvious other productions? Do I dare ask? Oh I guess I just did.
No just wondering out loud
:wink:
JohnU
Member
I think your fine as long as you don't make it exactly like his. Don't put the parts in the exact same place and don't name it what he calls them.
jttheclockman
Member
I think the original poster wants to know of someone who makes the watch pen blank. Maybe someone could make him one. I am sure it will be pricy. All the other stuff about patent on this was nonsense then as it is now. The post that Roy posted is one I posted back in the other thread too. The thing that may have some problem if you use say a Timex face or one of the other well known people. Not sure about that. I would not worry about it. Go for it and hope you post a photo if you get this done.
atomic ray
Member
Well that is all very interesting...I have dealt with copyrights and artwork for most of my life...my grandmother, mother, and I were/are artists/gallery owners, and I have been involved with prints, reproductions, and copies for the better part of 35 years...and until it becomes an issue for me personally I will refrain from commenting on an informal casual forum.
When I make my clock gear artwork, too include pens, I will entertain any and all copyright actions...I will offer this though...good luck.
In this world of casting and turning...the idea of inserting found items, blending minerals, etc...is a process. A common use process like cutting a dovetail into wood, soldering lead around leaded glass, or painting happy clouds.
You can not own a common use process, period.
You can trademark a name of a product, process, or other but it must be a proven unique subject without professional competition...this requires lawyers and process writers to do due diligence and research...and most importantly time and money.
Just saying "this is mine" is fine. A common understanding among artists is that a unique process that is recognizable as a particular artist's "copyright"...until someone else uses it
The rules of copyright are complex and full of layers and layers of BS.
But the basics are quite simple.
Fair use is not simple...but it is easier to avoid any situation where you think it is under fair use, because it most likely is not.
Trade marks need to be defended and used or they can lose validity and strength in civil action.
Copyrights protect the artist, writer, designer, and related creative process individual/company.
That said, the idea of copyrighting a process that is not unique...embedding materials in resin is as old as amber...is just odd to me.
Now with that, if the item(s) to be embedded is a piece of art...poetry, logo, etc...art as defined as a unique product of a creative process...then that portion of the process is protected under a common law understanding copyright but would need to be documented.
So if the item going into the resin was made by "insert name" then that element is generally protected but not the process of inserting.
Circuit boards, bugs, broken glass, etc. are all found items and would never hold up in court.
"I put broken glass in resin and made a pen" "so it is my copyrighted product/process and no one else can make a glass bit pen without my permission"...I can only imagine the look from the judge on that one.
Enough on this...I will be making watch part art, as I have before...not as a pen yet but I will plan to make watch part pens...and damn the torpedoes.
I hope this does not ruin my chances for friendly forum opportunities, but this is honestly a silly argument...now go make some pens!
:bananen_smilies046:
Raymond
When I make my clock gear artwork, too include pens, I will entertain any and all copyright actions...I will offer this though...good luck.
In this world of casting and turning...the idea of inserting found items, blending minerals, etc...is a process. A common use process like cutting a dovetail into wood, soldering lead around leaded glass, or painting happy clouds.
You can not own a common use process, period.
You can trademark a name of a product, process, or other but it must be a proven unique subject without professional competition...this requires lawyers and process writers to do due diligence and research...and most importantly time and money.
Just saying "this is mine" is fine. A common understanding among artists is that a unique process that is recognizable as a particular artist's "copyright"...until someone else uses it
The rules of copyright are complex and full of layers and layers of BS.
But the basics are quite simple.
Fair use is not simple...but it is easier to avoid any situation where you think it is under fair use, because it most likely is not.
Trade marks need to be defended and used or they can lose validity and strength in civil action.
Copyrights protect the artist, writer, designer, and related creative process individual/company.
That said, the idea of copyrighting a process that is not unique...embedding materials in resin is as old as amber...is just odd to me.
Now with that, if the item(s) to be embedded is a piece of art...poetry, logo, etc...art as defined as a unique product of a creative process...then that portion of the process is protected under a common law understanding copyright but would need to be documented.
So if the item going into the resin was made by "insert name" then that element is generally protected but not the process of inserting.
Circuit boards, bugs, broken glass, etc. are all found items and would never hold up in court.
"I put broken glass in resin and made a pen" "so it is my copyrighted product/process and no one else can make a glass bit pen without my permission"...I can only imagine the look from the judge on that one.
Enough on this...I will be making watch part art, as I have before...not as a pen yet but I will plan to make watch part pens...and damn the torpedoes.
I hope this does not ruin my chances for friendly forum opportunities, but this is honestly a silly argument...now go make some pens!
:bananen_smilies046:
Raymond
Tony's Pens
Member
I am with atomic ray. I also mentioned in my post earlier that as long as the clock parts pen is not exactly as a copy-write pen then there is no reason not to Go For It.
I don't think you will be getting a call or letter from a lawyer after making this clock pen for your friend.
I don't think you will be getting a call or letter from a lawyer after making this clock pen for your friend.
bitshird
Member
I'm with Ray on this, as soon as I find enough parts,I'm going to make a couple, after all I have these resinsvarer molds and I hate to waste them just doing rattlesnake pens.
atomic ray
Member
I would welcome a letter or legal action...one of my best customers (electronics for his big boat) is a patent/copyright/trademark/etc. corporation action lawyer...the last issue that came up ended in one phone call.
This sort of thing comes up quite often because of public/common misconception and belief in anything that is typed.
Copyright law is hard to read, it hurts my head every time I dig into it...
But in the end this is not a matter of copyright.
vivent longtemps l'artiste
:bananen_smilies046:
Raymond
This sort of thing comes up quite often because of public/common misconception and belief in anything that is typed.
Copyright law is hard to read, it hurts my head every time I dig into it...
But in the end this is not a matter of copyright.
vivent longtemps l'artiste
:bananen_smilies046:
Raymond
Not unless it's PSI. "He" already sells several "name-branded" products through Penn State. I don't think that it would be much of a stretch for a watch parts blank to appear on the pages of their catalog in the future with his name attached to it.
PTownSubbie
Member
If I am not mistaken, when all this uproared last time the blank was created as close to the original as possible. I think that is where the rub lied...not that he created it but that he duplicated the original but I could be wrong.
johnspensandmore
Member
Watch parts are pretty thin so it seems like it would be easy enough to cast some against some sort of background. Send me some watch parts and I'll give it a shot!
Good luck!
Good luck!
MrPukaShell
Member
I would call it a "Pocket Watch Pen" then you would not have to worry.
Willee
Member
Ray ... cast your watch parts.
Dont worry about it.
You are free to do what you want when making your pens.
Just because someone paints a picture of a tree dont mean no one else can.
Same with making a pen.
It is an art form and no one owns any of that.
glycerine
Member
To answer the original OP, I think this question must first be answered: What type of pen are you looking to get blanks for?
I believe it has already been mentioned that the parts are glued to the tubes and then cast. I don't know of anyone who sells pre-made blanks. But if you'll say what type of pen you need them for, I'm sure someone could make one for you if you are unable to make your own.