Group Buy: Triple start taps and dies - kitless pens

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Jarod888

Jarod888

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Hello all-

I am in the beginning phases of starting a group buy for kitless pen taps and dies.
I'm working with Monty on all the steps. Eharri446 is also helping me with the spreadsheets, etc.

So far, ive requested a quote from Tapco and it is in the works. I listed about every tap and die I could think of / research for the quote, but if I missed any, I will have it amended.
The initial quote is for the following:
M9, M10, M12, M13, M14 triple start taps and dies. I requested the price for taper, plug and bottoming taps.

M10x1 tap and die
M9x1 tap and die
M9x.75 tap and die
M8.5x1 tap and die
M8.5x.75 tap and die

Jowo #5, 6 and 8.
Bock #5 and 6

I know I am missing m11 triple start taps and dies.

I will also amend the request to include dies for all jowo and bock mentioned above.

Does anyone else have any recommendations? I was also thinking of requesting m15 triple start tap and dies.

Would the required drill bits be of interest?
If so, will someone with appropriate knowledge please post the needed sizes?

I am thinking that the official signup will be within the next 2 weeks. Looking to give people plenty of time, so I dont think the official order will be until around May 1. This gives folks some time to get tax refunds /save up.

I will accept as many people as are willing to signup and commit. I also think I am will willing to accept international folks, but please be aware that shipping, etc will be higher.

I want to accept payment via paypal friends and family. I think am willing to consider checks and cashiers checks, but they must clear before any shipment. Paypal would definitely be my preference.

Please respond if interested to this thread. Post your wanted items. Also, please post any other requests for tap and die sizes, not mentioned above and I'll see if they can be added to the quote.
Thanks!
 
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You can count me in for 10mm and 11mm triple-start taps and dies!

In the last group buy, I purchased a 14mm triple-start set. Based on my research, I expected to receive a 1.5" die for that set due to the strength concerns of how thin the die gets at the flutes near the outer circumference on a 1" die. What I received was a 1" die for the 14mm. Might be worth confirming with TapCo what the recommended die size would be at 14 and 15mm?... or the materials it is suited for at that size?

Also, regarding the tap for the Jowo being too small, in my experience, the Jowo has always been fine, it is the Bocks that are waayyy too small for the housings... See this thread: https://www.penturners.org/threads/tight-fitting-bock-housing-threads.163580/
Is it possible to donate a housing for Tapco to confirm the threading for each of the varieties among Jowo and Bock??
 
Jarod888 said:
Hello all-

I am in the beginning phases of starting a group buy for kitless pen taps and dies.
I'm working with Monty on all the steps. Eharri446 is also helping me with the spreadsheets, etc.

So far, ive requested a quote from Tapco and it is in the works. I listed about every tap and die I could think of / research for the quote, but if I missed any, I will have it amended.
The initial quote is for the following:
M9, M10, M12, M13, M14 triple start taps and dies. I requested the price for taper, plug and bottoming taps.

M10x1 tap and die
M9x1 tap and die
M9x.75 tap and die
M8.5x1 tap and die
M8.5x.75 tap and die

Jowo #5, 6 and 8
For Jowo #6, I requested 7.5x.5, because ive read several threads mentioning that 7.4 x .5 is too small.
Bock #5 and 6

I know I am missing m11 triple start taps and dies.

I will also amend the request to include dies for all jowo and bock mentioned above.

Does anyone else have any recommendations? I was also thinking of requesting m15 triple start tap and dies.

Would the required drill bits be of interest?
If so, will someone with appropriate knowledge please post the needed sizes?

I am thinking that the official signup will be within the next 2 weeks. Looking to give people plenty of time, so I dont think the official order will be until around May 1. This gives folks some time to get tax refunds /save up.

I will accept as many people as are willing to signup and commit. I also think I am will willing to accept international folks, but please be aware that shipping, etc will be higher.

I want to accept payment via paypal friends and family. I think am willing to consider checks and cashiers checks, but they must clear before any shipment. Paypal would definitely be my preference.

Please respond if interested to this thread. Post your wanted items. Also, please post any other requests for tap and die sizes, not mentioned above and I'll see if they can be added to the quote.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
Jarod888 said:
Hello all-

I am in the beginning phases of starting a group buy for kitless pen taps and dies.
I'm working with Monty on all the steps. Eharri446 is also helping me with the spreadsheets, etc.

So far, ive requested a quote from Tapco and it is in the works. I listed about every tap and die I could think of / research for the quote, but if I missed any, I will have it amended.
The initial quote is for the following:
M9, M10, M12, M13, M14 triple start taps and dies. I requested the price for taper, plug and bottoming taps.

M10x1 tap and die
M9x1 tap and die
M9x.75 tap and die
M8.5x1 tap and die
M8.5x.75 tap and die

Jowo #5, 6 and 8
For Jowo #6, I requested 7.5x.5, because ive read several threads mentioning that 7.4 x .5 is too small.
Bock #5 and 6

I know I am missing m11 triple start taps and dies.

I will also amend the request to include dies for all jowo and bock mentioned above.

Does anyone else have any recommendations? I was also thinking of requesting m15 triple start tap and dies.

Would the required drill bits be of interest?
If so, will someone with appropriate knowledge please post the needed sizes?

I am thinking that the official signup will be within the next 2 weeks. Looking to give people plenty of time, so I dont think the official order will be until around May 1. This gives folks some time to get tax refunds /save up.

I will accept as many people as are willing to signup and commit. I also think I am will willing to accept international folks, but please be aware that shipping, etc will be higher.

I want to accept payment via paypal friends and family. I think am willing to consider checks and cashiers checks, but they must clear before any shipment. Paypal would definitely be my preference.

Please respond if interested to this thread. Post your wanted items. Also, please post any other requests for tap and die sizes, not mentioned above and I'll see if they can be added to the quote.
Thanks!
Click to expand...

I'm interested in 12,13 and 14 triple tap and die sets
 
TAPCO can provide the 14mm die in either 1" or 1.5" diameters. When I did the two previous group buys we went with the 1" to make it easier to get a die holder that was common to all of the dies.
 
Interested in the following with final decision being made once price is determined.

1) M14 triple tap & die
2) M13 triple tap & die
3) M10 triple tap & die

**Thank you for doing this !
 
Jarod888 said:
Hello all-

I am in the beginning phases of starting a group buy for kitless pen taps and dies.
I'm working with Monty on all the steps. Eharri446 is also helping me with the spreadsheets, etc.

So far, ive requested a quote from Tapco and it is in the works. I listed about every tap and die I could think of / research for the quote, but if I missed any, I will have it amended.
The initial quote is for the following:
M9, M10, M12, M13, M14 triple start taps and dies. I requested the price for taper, plug and bottoming taps.

M10x1 tap and die
M9x1 tap and die
M9x.75 tap and die
M8.5x1 tap and die
M8.5x.75 tap and die

Jowo #5, 6 and 8
For Jowo #6, I requested 7.5x.5, because ive read several threads mentioning that 7.4 x .5 is too small.
Bock #5 and 6

I know I am missing m11 triple start taps and dies.

I will also amend the request to include dies for all jowo and bock mentioned above.

Does anyone else have any recommendations? I was also thinking of requesting m15 triple start tap and dies.

Would the required drill bits be of interest?
If so, will someone with appropriate knowledge please post the needed sizes?

I am thinking that the official signup will be within the next 2 weeks. Looking to give people plenty of time, so I dont think the official order will be until around May 1. This gives folks some time to get tax refunds /save up.

I will accept as many people as are willing to signup and commit. I also think I am will willing to accept international folks, but please be aware that shipping, etc will be higher.

I want to accept payment via paypal friends and family. I think am willing to consider checks and cashiers checks, but they must clear before any shipment. Paypal would definitely be my preference.

Please respond if interested to this thread. Post your wanted items. Also, please post any other requests for tap and die sizes, not mentioned above and I'll see if they can be added to the quote.
Thanks!
Click to expand...
In the past when doing group buys, what was the average cost for say a 13 mm triple start tap and die set?
 
Derhul said:
In the past when doing group buys, what was the average cost for say a 13 mm triple start tap and die set?
Click to expand...
Remember, the price entirely depends on how many people that can commit to any one product, so the last group buy's price might be different than this one. That being said, it was $117.10 for the 13mm tap/die combo. That and the 12mm were the same. 11mm was much higher and the 14mm was marginally higher.
 
hokie said:
Does that acknowledgement mean they will remain missing for some reason or it was just a mistake and you plan to include 11mm as an option? I assume the latter, but one can never be too sure of anything!
Click to expand...
All it means is that when I sent the email to tapco, I forgot to ask for m11. I also forgot about m15 and dies for all the bock and jowo taps. I've since corrected that and sent another email asking for prices on those. I should have the preliminary price list early next week.
 
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hokie said:
Remember, the price entirely depends on how many people that can commit to any one product, so the last group buy's price might be different than this one. That being said, it was $117.10 for the 13mm tap/die combo. That and the 12mm were the same. 11mm was much higher and the 14mm was marginally higher.
Click to expand...
Gotcha thanks
 
I have the pricing from tapco. I need to get it organized and build the spreadsheet. I will get all that done in the next couple of days and the get my preliminary post to Monty for review. Once I have the go-ahead, I will create a new thread in the group buy section.

Thanks everyone for your interest and support in running my very first group buy!
 
I'm confirming a few things with the representative from tapco and once I have the final info, I will post a pdf of it in this thread. Then, I will work on building the excel file for individual orders and get the post ready for the official group buy. I'm hoping to have that approved and posted by mid next week.
 
All, please see the attached pdf file. It contains all the sizes of taps and dies for this group buy. It contains the price per item depending upon the quantity ordered.
Some brief highlights and clarifications:
1. The maximum level for tap discount is 48 items, meaning if more than 48 items are ordered in any single individual size, there will be no further discount. Simply said, for any size of tap, the price per tap is the same for 48 as it is for 100.
2. There are three styles of every tap offered. The price is the same no matter the style. For any one size, the maximum discount quantity can be achieved by any combination of style which adds up to that discount level. For example: M10 x.8 - 10 plug taps, 2 taper taps and 14 bottoming taps would equate to the discount level of 24 M10 x.8 taps. We DO NOT need to achieve 24 of each style of the SAME SIZE to get the level 24 discount.
3. Each size discount is independent of any other size. The maximum discount level will be based upon the number of all styles of that size ordered. Simply put, sizes DO NOT combine for discount level.
4. The maximum discount level for dies is 12.
5. Each die size is independent of other die sizes for the maximum discount. M10 x.8 Only counts towards M10 x.8.
6. There are 3 die sizes which tapco has not made / needs to remake the hob in order to make. Those three will require a tooling charge. The tooling charge is dependent on the size. In the pdf document, those dies are highlighted and at the bottom there is an asterisk (*) line for each specific size with the tooling charge. This charge IS NOT per individual die, rather it is for that size. So in order to be fair, the tooling charge will be split among the orderers of those particular sizes. The more orders, the lower the extra charge per person. For example, the tooling charge for the M9 x.8 triple start die is $90. The maximum discount level is $80.60. So if 12 people order that die, the tooling charge per person would be $90/12= $7.50. So each person would pay $88.10 per die. If 24 people ordered the die, the tooling charge would be $90/24= $3.75, so the total per person for that die would be: $84.35.

Please review the pdf file. The official group buy thread will be posted next week. I have to write it, and build the individual spreadsheets and have it approved by Monty.
I would really like to get some indication on what levels we will be at for the group buy, so please respond to this post if you are firmly committed to specific sizes. I am planning on having a fairly lengthy signup window - probably 30 days or so. I want to get the most people we can, so we can get the maximum discount level for every item. I also understand the sheer cost associated with these, so I want to give people lots of time to search their couch cushions, pick up extra shifts at work, skip the morning Starbucks, etc. to save up the money for this.

Once the official thread is up, I will start tallying the numbers and keep everyone up-to-date on the discount level.
 

Attachments

  • Patrick_Tap_Die_Print1.pdf
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Thank you for volunteering to herd cats!
I am very serious about the T/D combos of 10,11,and 14mm (assuming 14mm is going to be 1.5"). I'm a maybe on 9 and 15mm (if one more purchase would move into the next discount level, I'd commit to them).
I am also intrigued by the Jowo/Bock dies. Are those to "chase" the threads on the housings or do people make their own housings? I'm definitely eyeing those as well, either way.
 
So the m14 and m15 will be 1.5 inch dies. All others are 1 inch.
As far as the dies, I think they could be used to clean up the threads on purchased dies, or used to make your own if you could source just the metal part.
 
May I ask why you would get standard size single start taps and dies made to order? The 9mm and 10mm taps and dies from Victor are a fraction of the cost of the Tapco ones.

I don't mean to criticize the hard work you are taking on behalf of the members because it is commendable.
 
I participated in a previous group buy, which was for double start threads. I purchased 10, 12, and 14mm taps and dies, I now view my purchase of the 10mm set as an unnecessary purchase, as the use of multi start threads are really only beneficial for cap threads as I see it. Unless you are making very thin pens, I don't see much need for anything less than 12 mm in multiple start threads.
I do use my 10mm double start set for section to body threads, but I am probably going to buy a cheaper single start set in a fine thread, as I feel single start threads for this situation is a better option, and a lot cheaper. This will make my 10mm set pretty much redundant.

So , if I was buying again, with what I know now, I would get 12, 13, and 14mm, I might be tempted by the 15 if I wanted to make very large pens. Maybe a #8 nib needs 15 mm cap threads, but I don't know if this is the case.
I have been using JoWo #6 nibs, in my view these are best suited to 13-14mm cap threads, though I have successfully used the 12mm threads with a #6 nib. See my Musk and green kitless fountain pen for an example.
I would guess #5 nibs would be suited to around 12mm threads.
I use my 12mm set for my kitless rollerballs.

I thought I would just offer my thoughts. I am relatively new to kitless penmaking, so take my comments for what they cost (free :)) But Hopefully this might help someone save money on buying something they don't really need.
But if you can see a need for the smaller sizes, by all means, take advantage of the opportunity to get what you need, as the group buys don't come along very often.
 
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