For the first time since joining

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alamocdc

alamocdc

Member
Joined
Apr 26, 2005
Messages
7,970
Location
San Antonio, Texas, USA.
I actually find myself almost being ashamed of being a member here. A new member with many years of experience comes to us and posts a link to a different direction in pen crafting (and a direction that a number of us have already taken) and he is immediately bashed for doing so. And yes, I feel telling someone they are pompous, arrogant and the other things implied, is bashing. The saddest part of all this? The majority of those up in arms on the negative have been members here no more than about 6 months. What a shame! When we can't share a different direction in perfecting a craft that many of us wish to pursue, I feel we've lost our purpose. So dies another. And that's really too bad.

Chris, on behalf of those of us who "heard" what you had to say, THANK YOU! And I'm so very sorry for your less than warm reception![:I][:I][:I]

I'll shut up now since I have nothing to say that would be constructive.
 
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Billy,

I agree completely. It would really be helpful if you guys would send me and or Jeff a note anytime to see something like this. It is difficult to be everywhere all the time.
 
There seems to be a lot of bitchy people around here of late. Quite frankly I would have to agree with you.

Mr. Thompson, please note its not usually this bad, it just seems like a lot of people have their pantys ina wad for some strange reason all at the same time.
 
Billy, I think your right and I also feel ashamed that we have "WELCOMED" a new member who could help us all.Chris has turned more wood pens than most of us and he has experience that we all need to feed from not bash. He has taken a different path to his pen turning and I for one applaud him for it.Now lets all get back to what we love and that's talking about Ed and Cav:D[}:)];).
 
I agree with your post. I read the article and saw the first couple of responses. I did not know that it went the direction that it did. :(
 
Damn, I missed that. I would have been delighted to bloody some noses. For those of you who called Chris arrogant and/or pompous, you better go look in the mirror. Chris has gone in a direction that most of you would never have conceived and has been quite successful at it. Is that the real problem? He's successful at making and selling pens? In all the time since I've been here, that is probably the nastiest string of drivel I've seen. Maybe some of you should think seriously about whether you ought to continue to hang around here.
 
Billy, thanks for bringing this to our attention. I cannot believe the absolute (to misquote Spiro Agnew) "nattering Neanderthal nabobs of negativism." For some reason, people who are successful at our craft/trade/art/whatever, are often dragged down by pursuing hordes of the envious.
 
Wow just read the tread, Thanks for posting Billy as I would have missed the tread and also missed the oportunity to learn a few things. And thats not just about pens.[}:)]
 
It's not just the mods' responsibility . . .it's important that we, ALL of us, protect the culture of IAP. Over the last few months we've lost some members because of negative, harsh posts. Whether you're a new member or an old timer, let's try a little harder to refrain from making statements that hurt the IAP community.
 
Originally posted by alamocdc

.... The saddest part of all this?...
Click to expand...
Billy, the saddest part of all this is that many of those who showed their juvenile behavior with BS this and BS that, will probably be the first in line to start asking "How did you do this?" or How did you do that?" or "please write us a tutorial" or Please give us step by step numbered instructions".

I looked at the profiles of several on the “welcoming committee†and noticed they had “Student†as their occupation. To me that is not descriptive enough as I am having a hard time determining if they mean grade school or middle school!
 
Wow!

Something happened and I was not chest deep in the middle of it :D I must be slipping.

I searched out the thread in question and read all of it and I went to Chris's site and read his articles and I learned a lot.


On behalf of the three amigo's (Me, Myself & I) Welcome Chris!
 
Wow all my heros in one thread. Ok all the old timers. :D I have not read his article yet I will try, I do agree since I have taken some time off turning to take care of Kelly there has been some negative threads. The funny part is no one has mentioned what I saw in his thread about working with THE IAP MEMBERS to come up with a nice article to post in the library or was I sleep deprived and seeing double.


With the size of the IAP I hope this is not going to be the direction it turns. We need to keep this a civil and welcoming site.

just my 2 coppers
 
I cannot weigh in since I cannot seem to see/find the tutorial.

I did find the responses to be extreme and thought there are things written that invoked such outburst. Later on others that I respect responded differently so I am at a loss really.
 
This thread took me to the other thread - and that's where I wrote this:

I logged in this morning looking for MPG 2008 comments, and stumbled across this thread. I've read all four pages of responses to Chris' first post, then I read the article.

I'm scratching my head trying to find what was wrong with the article. I didn't sense any negative, implied negatives, or anything else. This just seemed like an informative, thought-provoking discussion of the direction Chris took.

It kind of dampened the fun and relaxed experience from Champaign yesterday. I wish I hadn't read this thread - but on the other hand, I wouldn't have found Chris's website or his article. There is a silver lining.......


I used to participate on a listserv for my professional instrument - clarinet - and found that this unmoderated list was just filled with people who like to argue and vent their insecurities. As a professional musician and conductor, and as a university professor who has taught for over 25 years, I had joined that listserv feeling that whatever contributions I might make would be respected by those "youngsters" and other teachers and performers who read the forum. Not so. In fact there was even a well-recorded, well-known professional clarinetist from the U.K. who was inflammatory, nasty, uncivil, and downright egotistical. I determined that the people who posted there, for the most part, wanted the attention of feeling important for having the courage to share their opinions - regardless of if their opinions mattered. After three years, I left the listserv - and, following the withdrawl of reading and posting on a daily basis, found that I was much happier not having to view and respond to that junk every day.

It is unfortunate that I see many similarities between that listserv for clarinetists and the thread that Billy posted about. Thankfully, having experienced the nastiness of the former listserv, the comments seemed somewhat tame in comparison to the other. Still - it isn't any fun to see a colleague who posted a well-meaning idea with a link to a good article be personally attacked over someone else's inability to read and understand context. I sense major insecurity at work here. Someone purchases a wood lathe, tools, blanks, and some inexpensive pen kits - makes what friends, family, and a few customers like - and then visualizes someone else as attacking those decisions by writing an article (two years earlier) that does not reinforce the person's mistaken notions of what place their penturning holds in the world today.

The best of the IAP remains. Those who post personal attacks eventually leave because they are not tolerated. This forum remains one of the few that I continue to frequent after several years - and that says something for the quality of the people who are members.

Regarding the 2008 MPG - it was nice to meet Billy, Terrence, Greg, and a few others I have only corresponded with via the forum or email - as well as to enjoy seeing Rich again - and to enjoy his humorous and relaxed demo. Everyone I met represented the IAP well.:D

Best wishes,
Roger Garrett
 
I read the article. It's good, solid advice about the pen hobby or the pen business. It's just a hobby for me but if I were a younger man, I believe I would explore the machining option. (I was once a machinist and loved the machinery.

I didn't read all the comments on the thread but flaming a fellow member, for being successful, is pretty low. It's a sad part of human nature that some of us hate winners. Who knows? Chris, I think your pens are terrific .
 
I felt pretty bad for Chris, his work is exemplary, he was kind enough to attempt to educate others about his craft. Being an assistant instructor I have come to realize that some people just can't be educated, I hope he continues to share his knowledge with us, I hope he doesn't get upset but here is a quote from his offering "Do not start turning pens unless you possess compassion, kindness, humility, meekness, and patience in substantial form" seems to me some of the people that so belligerently flamed Mr. Thompson should load up their junk and head to Goodwill or the nearest flea market and divest themselves of their hobby. it seems they have given the IAP a [B)]
 
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