Can't get a good shine on Alumilite

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bitshird

bitshird

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I normally cast my own blanks usually use silmar 41, But I bought some blanks made with Alumilite, I just can't get the same gloss on them I get with PR, I sanded to 1500 them polished with Novus plastic polish , all 3 steps, they look OK but just not as shiny as Polyester, I tried buffing the pen but it still really didn't help, is Alumilite just not as glossy as Polyester Resin??
 
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Ken,
The old Alumilite didn't shine as well as PR for me. The new-Crystal Clear ? shines up very nicely. I think this is one reason for the new formula. I bet Curtis can answer this better for us.
 
greenmtnguy said:
Ken,
The old Alumilite didn't shine as well as PR for me. The new-Crystal Clear ? shines up very nicely. I think this is one reason for the new formula. I bet Curtis can answer this better for us.
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Alton,
I thought this was made from the new crystal clear, Me thinks I just don't know what I'm doing with it, The blanks look sharp as heck, the finished pen is very smooth, just don't got no fine shine line.
 
bitshird said:
I normally cast my own blanks usually use silmar 41, But I bought some blanks made with Alumilite, I just can't get the same gloss on them I get with PR, I sanded to 1500 them polished with Novus plastic polish , all 3 steps, they look OK but just not as shiny as Polyester, I tried buffing the pen but it still really didn't help, is Alumilite just not as glossy as Polyester Resin??
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I have the same issue.

If I use PR the finish is clear and hard but when I try to insert the pen parts they crack AND alloto f trouble keeping the air out. That is why I am trying allumilite.
 
This thread is disappointing to me. I have not tried the Crystal clear but I have the water clear. I was hearing but it mt be from hard core followers and tainted that the new formula Crystal clear polishes to a shine equal to that of PR.

I know water clear didn't even come close and I got a lot of complaints. One of the main resin I stopped using it. I was considering some Crystal clear for a new project as I think it is still easer to turn (does it still turn like the old water clear) but if the shine is not equal to PR that is a big problem. I know for Curtis it is not a problem because with cactus and worthless wood and anything else using 2 different mediums you need a CA finish anyway. But for a straight clear cast I would hate to have to tell a customer to put a CA finish to achieve a high gloss shine equal to PR.

I would like to hear a few more opinions. We just can't get an ideal formula the best of both worlds. The hard high gloss shine of PR with out the brittleness and the forgiving easy working of the Alumilte.

Bruce
 
I have a blank that was made with a 3/4" piece of black PR and a 3/4" piece of CC Alumilite glued together with epoxy. I made the blank this way so that any variability in turning, sanding, or polishing would be eliminated. You can not tell the difference in shine between the 2 and had about 10 different people look at it and tell me which side had better gloss. I may be biased but that was my experience.
 
You've never asked me to look at that blank.:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin:
Do a good turn daily!
Don

MesquiteMan said:
I have a blank that was made with a 3/4" piece of black PR and a 3/4" piece of CC Alumilite glued together with epoxy. I made the blank this way so that any variability in turning, sanding, or polishing would be eliminated. You can not tell the difference in shine between the 2 and had about 10 different people look at it and tell me which side had better gloss. I may be biased but that was my experience.
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I have not asked anyone to compare, just myself. The new CC polishes far better than the old, but does not hit the PR shine. If you like shine, it should be acceptable, but it won't be the shiniest you ever saw. I think it's a nice shine with a touch of warmth. There's no question it's a harder formula when you spin it, it's not as rubbery.
 
Jgrden said:
Are you using the 3 sec. hot stuff?
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No I just use the easy bond from Mannie, (monty)

bruce119 said:
This thread is disappointing to me. I have not tried the Crystal clear but I have the water clear. I was hearing but it mt be from hard core followers and tainted that the new formula Crystal clear polishes to a shine equal to that of PR.

I know water clear didn't even come close and I got a lot of complaints. One of the main resin I stopped using it. I was considering some Crystal clear for a new project as I think it is still easer to turn (does it still turn like the old water clear) but if the shine is not equal to PR that is a big problem. I know for Curtis it is not a problem because with cactus and worthless wood and anything else using 2 different mediums you need a CA finish anyway. But for a straight clear cast I would hate to have to tell a customer to put a CA finish to achieve a high gloss shine equal to PR.

I would like to hear a few more opinions. We just can't get an ideal formula the best of both worlds. The hard high gloss shine of PR with out the brittleness and the forgiving easy working of the Alumilte.

Bruce
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Bruce, it does turn easier than PR it seeems like it's softer to me, That seems like the problem, It's not bad, and it could possibly nbe the stuff that's mixed with it causing the dull finish, I use quite a bit of Pearl Ex in my PR and no problems, I'm not sure what the guy I bought these from uses. The pen looks OK, it just doesn't have a razor sharp reflection line like I get with PR or a CA finish, in reality a CA finish is still a bit higher gloss than PR but PR gets a lot closer than this.

MesquiteMan said:
I have a blank that was made with a 3/4" piece of black PR and a 3/4" piece of CC Alumilite glued together with epoxy. I made the blank this way so that any variability in turning, sanding, or polishing would be eliminated. You can not tell the difference in shine between the 2 and had about 10 different people look at it and tell me which side had better gloss. I may be biased but that was my experience.
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Curtis, I don't dispute your claim at all, I like the way it cuts, it may just be the stuff that wa mixed with it to produce the color shift effect, I'm going to try some other things, I think the brittleness of PR also adds to it's ability to get a high polish something to do on a molecular level, the same difference between Glass and acrylic. the harder the material and the higher the density the better gloss it should have. theoretically. But we ain't dealing with theory dang it.
Ken
 
Actually, Alumilite is HARDER than PR but it has more ELONGATION meaning it will stretch more before it breaks. The elongation is what determines the "brittleness". Alumilite has more "long segments" molecularly than PR. The new Crystal Clear has more short segments than the water clear but still not as much as PR.

Not sure how you did your finishing but you might try wet sanding with light touches when getting into the higher grit. Also make sure you clean the blank real well before changing grit.
 
MesquiteMan said:
Not sure how you did your finishing but you might try wet sanding with light touches when getting into the higher grit. Also make sure you clean the blank real well before changing grit.
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Now that's some good advice. My experience with Alumilite isn't even comparable to Curtis's but I have noticed that when dry sanding, especially with the finer grits, it tends to clog the sandpaper quickly. I think that might be why it's more difficult to remove the previous grit marks with a finer grit. Wet sanding greatly reduces the clogging issue. Of course, this really only applies to 100% Alumilite blanks, not worthless wood and the like.
 
babyblues is right on the Worthless Wood part. It is HIGHLY recommended to use a film finish such as CA when finishing Worthless Wood, regardless of the resin used.
 
If you are not getting a good shine on the Crystal Clear blanks, make sure you are wet sanding them and finally sanding them with micro mesh all the way up to 12000 grit, you don't have to go any higher than that to get a great shine. I do this and don't use anything afterwards other than maybe some Ren wax.
 
wolftat said:
If you are not getting a good shine on the Crystal Clear blanks, make sure you are wet sanding them and finally sanding them with micro mesh all the way up to 12000 grit, you don't have to go any higher than that to get a great shine. I do this and don't use anything afterwards other than maybe some Ren wax.
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Neil, I start wet sanding from 400 where is where I start sanding nearly every thing I turn from, I don't have any Micro Mesh I've never owned any, usually I only sand to 800 wet before I polish, I got fro 400 to 600 to 800 to Chrome Oxide on a jewelry buffer, normally this gicves me a shine line about the width of a razors edge in bright light, the shine line on this piece is there but not well defined, and the color is so dark, I can't get a decent shot, My lighting system sucks! But I wet sanded this to 1500, and then used Novus plastic polish from 1 to 3. It looks OK, but just doesn't have the glass look I usually get with PR, I do clean between each grit, and wipe down with DNA.
 
bitshird said:
But I wet sanded this to 1500, and then used Novus plastic polish from 1 to 3. It looks OK, but just doesn't have the glass look I usually get with PR, I do clean between each grit, and wipe down with DNA.
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That might be a bit of a jump from the 1500 to the polishes.. since it is a
different material ,you can't treat it the same as PR and expect the same
results. (if it was just the same, you'd be using the PR)
Might be a bit of a jump from the 800 to 1500 also.

If you have any 1200, try putting that in between the 800 and 1500. 2000
after that might also help.

Also, you might try the first Novus step two or three times before moving
onto the next one. It is possible that the jumps are just a bit too much
for the material.

I've had good luck with the PastX polish (ran out of Novus, and this is
much less expensive) but I find I'll do it two or three times instead of
just once. Still get a high gloss, just takes an extra 10 seconds or so.

All this is guesswork and opinion. I'm no authority on it.

ps.. try wiping with water instead of DNA and see if that makes any
difference.. I'm not sure if the alcohol may react with the resin in
some way. But if you're finishing resin, I'm not sure that the DNA gives
you any sort of advantage over water anyway. Just a thought.
 
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My sanding regiment for everything plastic weather it be CA or PR or Acrylic. I wet sand all the way starting with 400 Norton then to micro mesh 1500 to 6000 then I use Novus 2 with a soft cloth at high speed keeping the cloth wet with the Novus 2 careful not to build heat. Then I take Novus 1 and just clean it off at low speed and buff it up with a clean dry cloth. I get a glass finish you have to get a loop with more than 25x power to see any tiny scratches.


Bruce
 
I wanted to say I am going to get a batch of the new Alumilte and find out for my self. I will give it another chance and I will be sure to give my opinion afterward for what's it worth.

But you know what they say opinions :eek:


.
 
bitshird said:
I don't have any Micro Mesh I've never owned any, usually I only sand to 800 wet before I polish
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Without being there to see your process first hand, I'd have to say this could be one factor in trying to achieve the finish you want on the Alumilite. The differences between the materials could be enough to make a difference in how it finishes out with your current technique.

A inexpensive investment in some MM could be a easy way to confirm if it part of the issue.
 
I have 2 gallons of the water clear waiting for me to get un-busy. I don't know why I bought that instead of the crystal clear other than I didn't understand the difference at the time.

I think people need to keep in mind that most materials polish up different than each other. I find this true with woods. Some woods require polishing out to 12000 MM and buffing to get the best shine, others do well with 600. They all heat up at different rates. Some I wet sand, others will stain badly with wet sanding. PR seems relatively easy to get a good shine.

Hardness is related to brittleness most of the time, but not always. Alumilite (I'm guessing) from what Curtis is saying RESISTS deformation better than PR. It may be softer, but has more strength. The technical term is PLASTICITY. This refers to a materials ability to deform and return to original shape. When a material reaches its yield strength it experiences PLASTIC DEFORMATION. In other words it doesn't return to original shape. I'm guessing that PR exhibits a tendency to develope fracture lines when stressed so it doesn't have the plasticity that Alumilite does.

I have cut back on the amount of catalyst in casting PR because this seems to help with the brittleness some.
 
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